Comments on: Different Leader, Same Mistake http://greenpolitics.ca/2008/10/different-leader-same-mistake/ A grassroots view of green politics Sun, 11 Jul 2010 17:12:58 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0 By: Stuart Hertzog http://greenpolitics.ca/2008/10/different-leader-same-mistake/comment-page-1/#comment-547 Stuart Hertzog Mon, 13 Oct 2008 07:28:16 +0000 http://greenpolitics.ca/?p=207#comment-547 You give many excellent reasons why Jane Sterk should run in Vancouver-Fairview, J-M. But to me, the main negatives are still that she’s a parachute candidate who does not live in the riding, and that her running there doesn’t build up the experience or exposure of local Greens. Her approach is a conventional ‘top-down’ political response and not a grassroots democratic one. To me, that’s a very important factor in Green politics. You give many excellent reasons why Jane Sterk should run in Vancouver-Fairview, J-M. But to me, the main negatives are still that she’s a parachute candidate who does not live in the riding, and that her running there doesn’t build up the experience or exposure of local Greens. Her approach is a conventional ‘top-down’ political response and not a grassroots democratic one. To me, that’s a very important factor in Green politics.

]]> By: Stuart Hertzog http://greenpolitics.ca/2008/10/different-leader-same-mistake/comment-page-1/#comment-546 Stuart Hertzog Mon, 13 Oct 2008 07:22:42 +0000 http://greenpolitics.ca/?p=207#comment-546 Jean, I think your comment may be better if attached to the next article, <a href="http://greenpolitics.ca/2008/10/05/time-for-a-coalition-of-the-opposition/" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">Time for a Coalition of the Opposition</a>. For some reason, it’s been put here. Unfortunately, I don't have a way of changing the comments to another post. As well, some comments have been marked as spam and held back by the system — luckily, I caught them. It’s a problem with the Akismet comment spam plugin. My apologies to Jean and everyone whose comments have been held back or lost to this. Jean, I think your comment may be better if attached to the next article, Time for a Coalition of the Opposition. For some reason, it’s been put here. Unfortunately, I don’t have a way of changing the comments to another post. As well, some comments have been marked as spam and held back by the system — luckily, I caught them. It’s a problem with the Akismet comment spam plugin. My apologies to Jean and everyone whose comments have been held back or lost to this.

]]> By: Jean Proulx http://greenpolitics.ca/2008/10/different-leader-same-mistake/comment-page-1/#comment-516 Jean Proulx Fri, 10 Oct 2008 08:11:13 +0000 http://greenpolitics.ca/?p=207#comment-516 Jean Proulx’s Picks: How to Stop Harper In Your Riding To begin with, full disclosure: I am a supporter of Stéphane Dion and the Liberals. I have been working as an ordinary grassroots Liberal volunteer in the riding of Westmount-Ville Marie during this election (go Marc Garneau, the first ever Canadian astronaut and a profoundly decent man!). Specifically I have worked on getting elderly supporters of Mr. Garneau, who do not have means of transportation, out to advanced polls so they can vote. I have also spent a lot of time on the phones speaking with voters in the riding. I am just an ordinary Liberal supporter though (not even a member since I forgot to renew the last time my membership card expired). I have no official position within the Liberal Party and I speak for no one except myself. In fact, I had drifted away from the Liberal Party in recent years and had become pretty apathetic about Canadian politics. Stéphane Dion got me interested again when he announced the Green Shift (which is a policy I think our country really needs). However, the thing I am most concerned about – the reason I am really revved up for this election - is because I would like to see Stephan Harper defeated. Badly *lol*. Stephen Harper is not a bad or ill-intentioned man. I just sincerely believe that his policies are bad for Canada. They are bad: • for our economy (especially our manufacturing sector and our long-term productivity/competitiveness) • bad for the environment • bad for our culture, • bad for women, • bad for our criminal justice system; • bad for national unity • bad for our country’s poor • bad for what’s left of the civility and spirit of mutual respect in Canadian politics • bad for democracy (especially for the Parliamentary press gallery), • bad for Canada’s place in the world • Heck they’re even bad for Alberta (especially for your environment and mid to long-term economic interests). I know that last message is unlikely to resonate but, hey, that is what I genuinely believe. And I love Alberta. We need Alberta to be strong to have a strong Canada. In any event, in the spirit of non-partisanship behind the strategic voting movement and based on information from www.voteforenvironment.ca, I am advising the following… • I urge all Liberals and NDP supporters and all non-affiliated and undecided voters to vote for Elizabeth May and the Green Party in Central Nova • I call on all anti-Harper forces to vote for independent Bill Casey in Cumberland--Colchester--Musquodoboit Valley J'encourage mes amis Libéral, NPD et dans le Parti Vert de voter pour le Bloc Québecois dans les comtés suivants.../ I encourage NDP, Liberal and Green supporters and independent voters to vote Bloc Québecois for strategic reasons in: • Beauport—Limoilou (Éléonore Mainguy) • Gaspésie--Îles-de-la-Madeleine (Raynald Blais) • Haute-Gaspésie--La Mitis--Matane—Matapédia (Jean-Yves Roy) • Jonquière—Alma (Chantale Bouchard) • Lévis-Bellechassse (Guy Bergeron) • Lotbinière--Chutes-de-la-Chaudière (Antoine Sarrazin-Bourgoin) • Louis-Hébert (Pascal-Pierre Paillé) • Montmorency--Charlevoix--Haute-Côte-Nord (Michel Guimond) • Québec (Christiane Gagnon) • Richmond-Arthabaska (André Bellavance) • Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot (Ève-Mary Thaï Thi Lac) • Saint-Maurice-Champlain (Jean-Yves Laforest) • Shefford (Robert Vincent) And, last but not least, I encourage Liberal, Green, and independent voters to vote NDP in: • Halifax (Megan Leslie) • Hamilton East-Stoney Creek (Wayne Marston) • Hamilton Mountain (Chris Charlton) • Oshawa (Mike Shields) • Ottawa Centre (Paul Dewar) • Elmwood-Transcona (Jim Maloway) • Kildonan-St. Paul (Ross Eadie) • Selkirk-Interlake (Pat Cordner) • Palliser (Don Mitchell) • Regina-Lumsden-Lake Centre (Fred Kress) • Regina-Qu’Appelle (Janice Bernier) • Saskatoon-Rosetown-Biggar (Nettie Wiebe) • British Columbia Southern Interior (Alex Atamanenko) • Burnaby-Douglas (Bill Siksay) • Burnaby-New Westminster (Peter Julian) • Kamloops-Thompson-Cariboo (Michael Crawford) • Nanaimo-Alberni (Zeni Maartman) • Nanaimo-Cowichan (Jean Crowder) • New Westminster-Coquitlam (Dawn Black) • Pitt Meadows-Maple Ridge-Mission (Mike Bocking) • Surrey North (Rachid Arab) • Vancouver Island North (Catherine Bell) For all other ridings I recommend that you consult http://www.voteforenvironment.ca just before the election Oct 14th and make an informed decision about the best way for you to help defeat Stephan Harper in your riding. In fact, it would be a good idea for ALL strategic voters to double-check the site just before voting. Feel free to link this note and spread the word. Jean Proulx’s Picks: How to Stop Harper In Your Riding

To begin with, full disclosure: I am a supporter of Stéphane Dion and the Liberals. I have been working as an ordinary grassroots Liberal volunteer in the riding of Westmount-Ville Marie during this election (go Marc Garneau, the first ever Canadian astronaut and a profoundly decent man!). Specifically I have worked on getting elderly supporters of Mr. Garneau, who do not have means of transportation, out to advanced polls so they can vote. I have also spent a lot of time on the phones speaking with voters in the riding. I am just an ordinary Liberal supporter though (not even a member since I forgot to renew the last time my membership card expired). I have no official position within the Liberal Party and I speak for no one except myself. In fact, I had drifted away from the Liberal Party in recent years and had become pretty apathetic about Canadian politics. Stéphane Dion got me interested again when he announced the Green Shift (which is a policy I think our country really needs).

However, the thing I am most concerned about – the reason I am really revved up for this election – is because I would like to see Stephan Harper defeated. Badly *lol*. Stephen Harper is not a bad or ill-intentioned man. I just sincerely believe that his policies are bad for Canada. They are bad:

• for our economy (especially our manufacturing sector and our long-term productivity/competitiveness)
• bad for the environment
• bad for our culture,
• bad for women,
• bad for our criminal justice system;
• bad for national unity
• bad for our country’s poor
• bad for what’s left of the civility and spirit of mutual respect in Canadian politics
• bad for democracy (especially for the Parliamentary press gallery),
• bad for Canada’s place in the world
• Heck they’re even bad for Alberta (especially for your environment and mid to long-term economic interests). I know that last message is unlikely to resonate but, hey, that is what I genuinely believe. And I love Alberta. We need Alberta to be strong to have a strong Canada.

In any event, in the spirit of non-partisanship behind the strategic voting movement and based on information from http://www.voteforenvironment.ca, I am advising the following…

• I urge all Liberals and NDP supporters and all non-affiliated and undecided voters to vote for Elizabeth May and the Green Party in Central Nova

• I call on all anti-Harper forces to vote for independent Bill Casey in Cumberland–Colchester–Musquodoboit Valley

J’encourage mes amis Libéral, NPD et dans le Parti Vert de voter pour le Bloc Québecois dans les comtés suivants…/ I encourage NDP, Liberal and Green supporters and independent voters to vote Bloc Québecois for strategic reasons in:

• Beauport—Limoilou (Éléonore Mainguy)
• Gaspésie–Îles-de-la-Madeleine (Raynald Blais)
• Haute-Gaspésie–La Mitis–Matane—Matapédia (Jean-Yves Roy)
• Jonquière—Alma (Chantale Bouchard)
• Lévis-Bellechassse (Guy Bergeron)
• Lotbinière–Chutes-de-la-Chaudière (Antoine Sarrazin-Bourgoin)
• Louis-Hébert (Pascal-Pierre Paillé)
• Montmorency–Charlevoix–Haute-Côte-Nord (Michel Guimond)
• Québec (Christiane Gagnon)
• Richmond-Arthabaska (André Bellavance)
• Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot (Ève-Mary Thaï Thi Lac)
• Saint-Maurice-Champlain (Jean-Yves Laforest)
• Shefford (Robert Vincent)

And, last but not least, I encourage Liberal, Green, and independent voters to vote NDP in:

• Halifax (Megan Leslie)
• Hamilton East-Stoney Creek (Wayne Marston)
• Hamilton Mountain (Chris Charlton)
• Oshawa (Mike Shields)
• Ottawa Centre (Paul Dewar)
• Elmwood-Transcona (Jim Maloway)
• Kildonan-St. Paul (Ross Eadie)
• Selkirk-Interlake (Pat Cordner)
• Palliser (Don Mitchell)
• Regina-Lumsden-Lake Centre (Fred Kress)
• Regina-Qu’Appelle (Janice Bernier)
• Saskatoon-Rosetown-Biggar (Nettie Wiebe)
• British Columbia Southern Interior (Alex Atamanenko)
• Burnaby-Douglas (Bill Siksay)
• Burnaby-New Westminster (Peter Julian)
• Kamloops-Thompson-Cariboo (Michael Crawford)
• Nanaimo-Alberni (Zeni Maartman)
• Nanaimo-Cowichan (Jean Crowder)
• New Westminster-Coquitlam (Dawn Black)
• Pitt Meadows-Maple Ridge-Mission (Mike Bocking)
• Surrey North (Rachid Arab)
• Vancouver Island North (Catherine Bell)

For all other ridings I recommend that you consult http://www.voteforenvironment.ca just before the election Oct 14th and make an informed decision about the best way for you to help defeat Stephan Harper in your riding. In fact, it would be a good idea for ALL strategic voters to double-check the site just before voting.

Feel free to link this note and spread the word.

]]> By: J-M Toriel http://greenpolitics.ca/2008/10/different-leader-same-mistake/comment-page-1/#comment-515 J-M Toriel Thu, 09 Oct 2008 01:14:25 +0000 http://greenpolitics.ca/?p=207#comment-515 One cannot even begin to compare Surrey-Panorama Ridge with Vancouver Fairview. This was a very good strategic move on Jane Sterk's part: 1) Popular Gregor Robertson won this riding in 2005 by swaying the soft-green vote from 2001 and the support of Vanessa Violini who ran for the Greens in 2001 as one of the strongly supported Green ridings. 2) Gregor Robertson was arguably the "greenest" MLA with the BC NDP. 3) As a new leader of the GPBC, Jane Sterk must raise her profile in the Lower Mainland where she is little known and this will raise her profile locally and provincially in an extremely high-profile contentious by-election. 4) The other candidates are women and have little or no political experience -- she has a better chance here than her home riding of Esquimalt (where she would run against a very popular NDP MLA, Maurine Karagianis. 5) Voters are much more willing to take a "leap of faith" during a by-election (as Elizabeth May found in London North-Centre where she nearly won against 3 strong candidates and Dan Grice found in Vancouver Quadra recently) 6) The polling average federally will be more a factor in urban ridings (like Vancouver Centre - which makes up much of the provincial Fairview boundary) and Adriane Carr and her campaign have done a lot of door knocking there with a similar message. 7) The NDP candidate is very weak and inexperienced leaving this riding wide open for the taking One cannot even begin to compare Surrey-Panorama Ridge with Vancouver Fairview. This was a very good strategic move on Jane Sterk’s part:
1) Popular Gregor Robertson won this riding in 2005 by swaying the soft-green vote from 2001 and the support of Vanessa Violini who ran for the Greens in 2001 as one of the strongly supported Green ridings.
2) Gregor Robertson was arguably the “greenest” MLA with the BC NDP.
3) As a new leader of the GPBC, Jane Sterk must raise her profile in the Lower Mainland where she is little known and this will raise her profile locally and provincially in an extremely high-profile contentious by-election.
4) The other candidates are women and have little or no political experience — she has a better chance here than her home riding of Esquimalt (where she would run against a very popular NDP MLA, Maurine Karagianis.
5) Voters are much more willing to take a “leap of faith” during a by-election (as Elizabeth May found in London North-Centre where she nearly won against 3 strong candidates and Dan Grice found in Vancouver Quadra recently)
6) The polling average federally will be more a factor in urban ridings (like Vancouver Centre – which makes up much of the provincial Fairview boundary) and Adriane Carr and her campaign have done a lot of door knocking there with a similar message.
7) The NDP candidate is very weak and inexperienced leaving this riding wide open for the taking

]]> By: Stuart Hertzog http://greenpolitics.ca/2008/10/different-leader-same-mistake/comment-page-1/#comment-484 Stuart Hertzog Mon, 06 Oct 2008 01:31:17 +0000 http://greenpolitics.ca/?p=207#comment-484 I don’t know for sure, but I have my suspicions. I don’t know for sure, but I have my suspicions.

]]> By: Stuart Hertzog http://greenpolitics.ca/2008/10/different-leader-same-mistake/comment-page-1/#comment-483 Stuart Hertzog Mon, 06 Oct 2008 01:29:29 +0000 http://greenpolitics.ca/?p=207#comment-483 The Greens would need a couple of dozen Elizabeth Mays to take out the worst of the government ministers. But by my reckoning, rather than being Elizabeth May clones, they should be Green community activists who actually live in the riding. And oops! Yes, it is indeed Vancouver-Fairview. I was confused by the Fairfield district of Victoria, where I live. Thanks for your comments and the correction. The Greens would need a couple of dozen Elizabeth Mays to take out the worst of the government ministers. But by my reckoning, rather than being Elizabeth May clones, they should be Green community activists who actually live in the riding.

And oops! Yes, it is indeed Vancouver-Fairview. I was confused by the Fairfield district of Victoria, where I live. Thanks for your comments and the correction.

]]> By: Hendrik de Pagter http://greenpolitics.ca/2008/10/different-leader-same-mistake/comment-page-1/#comment-481 Hendrik de Pagter Sun, 05 Oct 2008 23:40:52 +0000 http://greenpolitics.ca/?p=207#comment-481 Well-argued. It would indeed be interesting to hear the leader's analysis and reasoning. I disagree with your suggestion that Elizabeth May should run in London North Centre because of her name recognition and to build on the 26% won in the by-election. She should run in Ottawa West-Nepean and demolish that attack dog Minister of Environmental Pillage John Baird. Yet others argue she should have run in Saanich-Gulf Islands and taken out Gary Lunn. Elizabeth's reasoning for choosing Central Nova was well-explained: her aging parents are in Nova Scotia and that's where she grew up as a teen and young adult. She wants to bring Atlantic Canada's voice to Parliament and she wants to take out the traitorous Peter MacKay, weak scion of Elmer MacKay and destroyer of the Progressive Conservative Party. I saw him interviewed today. He won't even mention her name. She's made her case, I think. By the way, I got a bit confused between Fairview and Fairfield. Which is it? Well-argued. It would indeed be interesting to hear the leader’s analysis and reasoning.

I disagree with your suggestion that Elizabeth May should run in London North Centre because of her name recognition and to build on the 26% won in the by-election. She should run in Ottawa West-Nepean and demolish that attack dog Minister of Environmental Pillage John Baird.

Yet others argue she should have run in Saanich-Gulf Islands and taken out Gary Lunn.

Elizabeth’s reasoning for choosing Central Nova was well-explained: her aging parents are in Nova Scotia and that’s where she grew up as a teen and young adult. She wants to bring Atlantic Canada’s voice to Parliament and she wants to take out the traitorous Peter MacKay, weak scion of Elmer MacKay and destroyer of the Progressive Conservative Party. I saw him interviewed today. He won’t even mention her name. She’s made her case, I think.

By the way, I got a bit confused between Fairview and Fairfield. Which is it?

]]> By: fire_walk_with_him http://greenpolitics.ca/2008/10/different-leader-same-mistake/comment-page-1/#comment-473 fire_walk_with_him Sat, 04 Oct 2008 16:23:38 +0000 http://greenpolitics.ca/?p=207#comment-473 I have to say although I much admire Jane Sterk as a person this one left me scratching my head. I can't see an upside on this one. Surely she doesn't think she can actually win this contest? Who indeed advised her on this? I have to say although I much admire Jane Sterk as a person this one left me scratching my head. I can’t see an upside on this one. Surely she doesn’t think she can actually win this contest? Who indeed advised her on this?

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